Rohan Pradyumna - Travana, Student turned Entrepreneur, AI Travel Planner | Indian Community #21

This episode of the Indian Community Podcast features Rohan Pradyumna, the creator of Travana, an innovative AI-powered travel planning platform. 

Amit Gupta discusses with Rohan his journey from completing his master's at the University of Maryland to becoming a job creator rather than a job seeker, his passion for storytelling, and his volunteer work. 

They delve into the challenges and opportunities of starting a technology-driven venture in the travel industry, the impact of current global job markets, the importance of AI in present and future entrepreneurship, and Rohan's personal connection to Indian itihasas (epics).

 Furthermore, Rohan shares his experience and future plans with Travana, aiming to simplify and enhance travel planning through artificial intelligence.

00:00 Welcome to the Indian Community Podcast
01:16 Meet Rohan: A Certified Storyteller and Entrepreneur
01:43 The Art and Impact of Storytelling
04:45 Rohan's Journey from Job Seeker to Job Creator
05:39 Navigating the Job Market and the Future of Work
12:46 Introducing Travana: Revolutionizing Travel with AI
23:44 The Genesis of Travana and the Future of Travel Planning
28:46 The Birth of Travana: From College Fest to Startup
29:36 The Rocky Road to Launching a Startup
31:07 Harnessing the Power of Community and AI in Entrepreneurship
32:57 The Role of Family and Friends in Entrepreneurial Success
35:58 Navigating the AI Startup Landscape: Insights and Advice
43:12 The Importance of Community and Unity in Entrepreneurship
51:55 Exploring Indian Itihasa and Personal Influences
57:12 Concluding Thoughts and Encouragement for the Indian Community

Join and Connect with us:
Indian Community: https://connect.indian.community/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bharatiya.community/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/bharatiyacommunity

Travana Website : https://travana.io/

#indiancommunity 
#rohanpradyumna
#travana
#AIinTravel
#TravelTech
#StartupJourney
#Entrepreneurship
#InnovativeTravel
#DigitalNomad
#Storytelling
#FutureOfWork
#CommunityImpact
#IndianItihasas

Transcript

Track 1: 0:00

Hello and welcome to another exciting episode of the Indian Community Podcast, where we shine the spotlight on inspiring personalities and their remarkable journeys. My name is Amit Gupta, and today I'm thrilled to have Rohan Pradyumna with us. He's a dynamic individual whose life is a blend of social impact, social Storytelling and technology. Rohan recently completed his master's at the University of Maryland and instead of becoming a job seeker after university, he's transformed into a job creator. He's the mastermind behind Travana, an innovative platform that merges AI with travel, Offering unfettered, unforgettable journeys to wanderlust driven adventurers. Rohan is also a certified storyteller, a product manager at heart, and a community volunteer for organizations such as make a difference and Hyderabad youth assembly. So join us as we dive into Rohan's world. exploring his journey from crafting digital solutions to impacting lives and everything in the middle. Welcome to the Indian Community Podcast, Rohan. I'm so excited to see you here.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 1:20

A pleasure is mine, Amit. I'm excited to be here as well. And that's a great introduction. Thank you so much.

Track 1: 1:25

Excellent. You know, the introduction has to be great because I'm speaking to a really, you know, powerful personality, Rohan. I'm so glad that we got to meet and talk on this podcast

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 1:37

I'm humbled, Amit. I mean, that's great to hear. Yeah, I'm excited for the conversation as

Track 1: 1:42

Perfect, Rohan. So Rohan, um, I noticed you call yourself as a certified storyteller.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 1:50

Yeah.

Track 1: 1:51

So how does one become a certified storyteller? Tell me a little bit more about this.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 1:55

Okay. Okay, cool. So, The story takes back, like, to my undergrad days. I just started my undergrad and I was all over the place. I was in every club in the college. I was in the dramatics club and everything. And that I realized that helped me was storytelling, was being able to speak. But not just speaking, not just blabbering. Speaking it in a form of a story. So I thought, why shouldn't it be a thing for myself? And then I saw if, are there any storytelling workshops or certifications that I can do? And then I found a certification on Udemy. Online, this is 2019. That was when Udemy and Udacity and everything was starting. And I saw a 18 hours storytelling workshop. Trust me, that is the biggest course that I ever did, but I finished and it really helped me to understand a lot of psychology behind storytelling and a lot of and elements of storytelling, which I really enjoyed. teach and I use and I've loved having that. So, it is simple. So I do call myself a certified storyteller, but it's just a Udemy certificate for that's it. But it's wonderful. The amount of knowledge that I have received in storytelling is unparalleled from that course.

Track 1: 3:11

That is beautiful. I think it, it doesn't matter where that certification is from, is as long as you were able to absorb the core message off that program, right? And, If it has chiseled you into becoming, um, um, a better storyteller, then

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 3:29

Yeah.

Track 1: 3:29

that's it. What do you think? So do you go around telling people's stories now?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 3:34

Oh, yeah. So telling stories is my favorite hobby. I've told, I have told stories all like last five, for the last five years. This is now is when I shifted into AI and travel and I don't speak as much as I would have liked, but telling stories is my favorite part time and, I loved it.

Track 1: 3:54

That is excellent.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 3:55

a lot.

Track 1: 3:55

So in fact, I should tell you we're very soon. We're going to be starting a storytelling You know, season on the Indian community podcast. I'm going to invite you over to tell us. Yeah, to tell us a story to our listeners. So it's going to be live streamed to all our followers and listeners. And, um, you know, we're speaking to a bunch of people who are also, you know, storytellers like you and they've got so many stories that they want to share with the world. So I'm going to make sure that you are also invited to one of those episodes. Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 4:28

we come from the land of stories. The amount of stories that we have in India are so much. And, We have to be telling them way. I mean, everyone in my sense should be a storyteller and tell the stories that the country has to offer.

Track 1: 4:41

Correct. Correct. Absolutely. That is very true. So Rohan, um, let's start with a story which I find very interesting, which is about you becoming a job creator. So let me put some context here. Um, every other day on, on LinkedIn, I receive a lot of reachouts from students in the US who are struggling to find a job. Or an OPT right after university and they're like, you know, we just want to do something. We don't mind even if you're not paid. We just want to get into a job or an OPT. And then recently we also saw a video from Indra Nooyi. She was also talking about this particular subject and why students should Probably consider staying back home and not coming here because of this whole job market being rough and OPT is being very difficult for somebody to, to find. So, um, how did you become a job creator instead of a job seeker, right? So you just completed your master's and here you are an entrepreneur who's doing so well. I really love what you do and we'll talk about that next. But how did you become? This you, how did you find yourself into a very different position from all these other students and what would you advise them to do?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 6:03

I think there are a lot of context to talk here, a lot of things to talk here. And, one thing that I want to address was that, is that, I never started all of this thinking about my OPT clock or thinking about be becoming a job creator or be, or not being a job taker. All of these are a part of a process, right? And coming back to how I did it, it was just because I was able to figure out starting a startup on my OPT. And because of that, I can be a self-employed. Self employed student, you have that option in your first year of your It doesn't happen in the STEM OPT, In the first one year, you can start set up your own corporation, your company, your LLC, and you get an EIN number. You should, you put it in your IEEE portal and you are good. You're good for that one

Track 1: 6:52

Okay.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 6:53

So your clock is stopped. And I do understand the reality of a lot of people not having jobs here. This is really unfortunate time to be in America. I would say this is one of the worst times to be in America as a student, as a job seeker, as an entry level job seeker, at least. Right. So most of the people who are currently in the job market right now are the ones who came in 21,

Track 1: 7:20

Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 7:20

This is the peak job market. Right. So when I was applying for my college and I got my admit and I had to make a decision, the thing that I was considering is that the average package for any University of Maryland was 140, 000 to 160, 000. 97 percent of the class before my batch, were placed. Looking at that stats, looking at that college, I would be excited. Anyone would be excited. The reality is so bad right now that not even 20 people from my class are placed

Track 1: 7:54

Correct,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 7:55

And this happened in the May, in, in May two years. And there are a lot of factors playing in it's not just a housing crash. It's not just a dot com bubble But there are multiple things happening globally economically and technically That are causing this challenge and I totally agree with indra nooyi's statement of Staying back in India and I personally would advise the same thing to people who want to come because we don't know I, I mean, more than Indra Nooyi's statement, I'm more concerned with Yuval Noah Harari statement, the author of Sapiens, where he said for the first time in history, I quote, for the first time in history, we don't know what skill will be relevant in the next 20 years. We cannot train our kids. We cannot train the youth to have the skills that would be relevant for the next 20 years. Right. And this is something that really terrifies me as a student, as a fresh grad, right. And This is a very unfortunate time to be in. We address that, but at the same time, understanding all of this and navigating chaos is really important, right? No one is going to come and give you, give everyone jobs all of a sudden. No one has come, is going to come and make everything all right. No one is going to come and Do things that would help you it is going to be like this and it is going to get much more terrible Once may happens another grad another set of people graduates, right? I know people who graduated in last may and are still unemployed and may last december and another may that is three batches of people unemployed Right. So this has to be an indication for people in India to stop coming, right? Because I mean, when if what we saw was our batch getting plays that motivated us to come, then what the next batch should see that there are three batches. Which are unplaced and stock coming, right? I'm not sure if that answers your question, but this is something that is around me a lot. Like I have a lot of friends here, a lot of cousins and relatives struggling with the same problem that everyone is facing. And it's really unfortunate. And the fear is real. The problem is real and we have to respect it. We have to acknowledge it. That's when we would be. can navigate it if we are in denial okay, Biden is going to come Biden is going to come and stay and jobs will go, jobs will come and Trump is going to come and new things will happen. None of that is going to matter because the biggest driver more than politics is technological We don't know data analyst is going to be relevant in the next two

Track 1: 10:46

correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 10:47

There are excellent e excellent AI bots in production, in making, are about to get deployed and about to get scaled that can do a job of an entry level data analyst hundred times

Track 1: 11:00

Very true.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 11:01

If you don't want to agree with me, you are in denial, but that is the truth. That is the truth of the matter.

Track 1: 11:07

I completely agree with you. Rohan. I'm not in denial, because

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 11:11

No.

Track 1: 11:11

I understand. I'm just you know, playing with words here, but as a parent also, right? So I have a teenager and when I think of, um, what they will do, you know, when they grow up and get into work, and I'm very confused right now because maybe 20 years back I would've been. Able to say, okay, yeah, you know, get into this. This is really good. I would be in a position to advise them. But now when I look at you know, what's happening in the industry, do you want to be a developer? Well, there's Devin and then there's and Devin is doing all of that. And, you know, so you don't. You don't know what to go back and share with your kids and because there's so much of flux, but I also feel that, um, this is a wave that comes every few years, right? So, there were bullet cars and then there were cars and then there were calculators and then there were computers and every time and then there were pages and then came mobile phones. So every time there was a really you. Seismic shift in the industry. Of course, AI is just multiplying the pace, right? So the pace at which it's changing is dramatic. But I think at some point, humanity is going to, you know, stabilize and find it equilibrium

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 12:27

Yeah. True.

Track 1: 12:27

figure out, okay, how do we work with this? And how do we use this to our advantage right now? It is, of course causing disadvantage to a lot of people. People. But I think at some point is going to be some stability. But until then, of course, like you said, there's going to be this whole flux, which is crazy. Um, so speaking about AI and startups. So let's talk about your startup, which is Travana. So what does Travana do? Let's hear that.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 12:56

Okay. Okay. So, um, Travana is an AI powered travel planner. We take user destination, their dates and their budget range, and we plan a perfect trip We make sure that we take as much inputs as possible. So that's when you enter into our personalization mode. Once you click on your personalization feature on our website, you get asked five questions and we will personalize your trip based on the answers for these questions. So this is what Travana does right now, but we want to be a travel super

Track 1: 13:28

Okay,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 13:29

So when you think about shopping, you remember Amazon, when you think about taxi, you remember

Track 1: 13:35

right.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 13:35

But when you think about travel, no one single app that is doing it, that, that is doing what

Track 1: 13:40

Mm hmm.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 13:40

That's when we come into our problem statement that to say that travel planning space is fragmented. It is broken and it is time consuming and it is really stressful. Like who has a job and who's like, you know, has a busy schedule. shit scared to start planning a

Track 1: 13:58

Oh, yeah.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 13:58

because it's a time consuming process. That's where we come in. We with Travana in future, you can use AI to plan trips. You can look at other itineraries, take inspiration, make their itineraries yours, follow your travel influencers. And we are planning to enter into real time intelligence. When we enter into real time intelligence, it would be like, we will travel with you. We will advise you on your trips. We will advise you on what can be done, what can't be done. If you are heading to a location, we will make sure that you have a parking spot for

Track 1: 14:30

Nice.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 14:31

And a lot of cool things like this. So, all in all, we want to be one stop solution for all the travel needs. So, as my professor Shiva used to say, a company is successful when it replaces a verb with a

Track 1: 14:45

Mm

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 14:46

I, we want to replace travel planning, which is a verb, with Travana, which is a

Track 1: 14:50

Wow. That is Wow. I love that. And I'm going to really think really hard on that. I love what you did with, you know, Travana, we're going to play up, you know, a screen share of what Travana does. And I love the way you've You you're looking at this problem and I'll tell you, I'll share my own experience, right? So,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 15:15

Definitely.

Track 1: 15:16

As a parent with with kids, um, and we've got the spring break coming we've got you know, there's a break coming up every now and then. And every time I have to think of planning travel. I just give it up because I don't know what to do. Like there are these places that you can go and things that you can do, but how do you do all of that? You don't know whether two days is enough or you need four. And, or what are the things that you can do? And I'll give you an example of like I, I love what you mentioned about doing this real time. Um, so there was there's a family friend of ours who went to Agra. So from Atlanta, all the way from Atlanta, he goes to Agra to see what

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 15:59

Taj

Track 1: 16:00

Taj Mahal, right? Unfortunately, he lands in Agra on a Friday.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 16:08

Oh, damn. That's bad.

Track 1: 16:14

So, he had just one day for Agra. Of course he was traveling across other cities. But I wish he had Travana. Hopefully Travana would tell him that, hey, don't go there on a Friday because You do not get entry into Taj Mahal on a Friday. Fortunately he was able to look at Taj Mahal from a distance

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 16:33

But the beauty is

Track 1: 16:34

But yeah, the beauty is getting close to it and you know, um admiring The architecture up close right up close, right?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 16:43

work.

Track 1: 16:44

Yeah, but, um, I am, I'm sure there will be a lot of people who would find themselves in similar spots, right? And making this whole thing simpler is really helpful. So, are you, um, do you tell them what they can do or do you also facilitate what they can do? So, for example, tickets to these places and air tickets and hotels, do you also do that?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 17:08

definitely. So, traditionally travel planning or traveling in general has been driven with bookings. So if you, like, if you can name the top three travel companies that you can, that comes to your mind, let's do this. Name three travel companies that comes to your

Track 1: 17:23

So I'll tell you, okay, so, being from India, um, and you know, we spent a lot of time with make my trip. So that's number one on you know, I still, even if I'm traveling from the U S I'm going to look up, make my trip because that's kind of baked into my DNA somehow we've used it so much. Um, and then, um, I use Expedia and, um, I also use hotels. com.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 17:48

Okay.

Track 1: 17:48

They kind of do it but then I don't trust them as much. Then I go back to Google and I use Google and I'll do the same thing on Google as well. So it becomes a big mashup of different sites. So I end up getting my prices jacked because I'm already, you know, trying this out on so many different sites.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 18:07

Yeah, so that, that's the problem I want to address right there. The four companies that you mentioned MakeMyTrip, Expedia, Hotels. com and Google for Trips or Google Bookings or anything related to bookings in Google, they're all dealing with giving you a flight, giving you a hotel, giving you a to stay, but none of them are dealing with what to

Track 1: 18:29

No, you've got to figure that out yourself.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 18:31

Yeah that's the problem because travel industry is structured in a way that it is making you book first and then figure out what you want to do. But it has to be the other way around where you should figure out what you want to do first and then stay then find a flight and then find a hotel that complements your trip. So we are here to rewire this. So Travana first lets you plan a trip. It lets you edit the way you want, with the amount of leisure, with the amount of packedness you want on a trip. you have it, once you have your trip figured out, once you have it sorted, that's when we will find the flights that complement your itinerary. We will find hotels, Airbnbs that complement your itinerary. All of these things are there to enhance your trip experience, but they are not the travel experiences

Track 1: 19:24

Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 19:25

right? So we want to rewire this process and we will definitely provide you with all the recommendations. And another problem that we have is. It's the same thing that you mentioned, that is information overload, right? So you want something that fits right into your budget, that fits right into your requirements and times, like, you know, your schedule and everything, right? And why do you have to go through a hundred different websites to do this? There can definitely be a single solution for all of this where you get the best deal possible for your needs. And that's what we are here to do.

Track 1: 20:02

That is great. In fact, um, what you just described brought, um, a very, um, powerful and impactful statement from one of my mentors Joe Pyne. He is the author of a beautiful book called The Experience Economy. Okay. And, um, the, there's one statement in that book which I will never forget and I think, um, it resonates with what you just said. Um, so Joe says, an experience occurs when a company intentionally uses its services as the stage and the goods as props to engage individuals in a way that creates value. A memorable experience, right? So now, when you just said all of this, I'm looking at Travana as you know, as the stage, right? And all of these as the props on that stage. So essentially, what's going to come back and play back is an experience, which is going to be so simplified and people should be able to find and just be able to travel. You know, knowing that, okay, what are they going to do? When are they going to do all of that? What are the places that they're going to be you know, visiting? Is it kid friendly? Is it accessible? All of that, right? So I love you know, where you're going to essentially, you're basically, um, enabling experiences, if I may say,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 21:29

very true. Very true. Our job is to facilitate experiences and not the havoc or not the hassle. We don't want you to be worried about would I get a best deal? Would I get the best ticket price? But I want you to worry about what experience should I have in my trip? If I'm going to Northern, see Northern Lights, then the worry shouldn't be on how am I reaching there, where am I getting down, where am I staying, and blah, blah, blah, but you're, you should worry about

Track 1: 21:59

am I going to get to see it? Yeah,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 22:02

enjoy Northern Lights everything

Track 1: 22:05

we had a similar sort of a situation the last two weeks where it is the cherry blossom season here in North America, where you know, everybody's going out to places to see and I'll tell you, I had to go to so many different sites just to figure out where can I go, um, you know, to see the cherry blossom. So hopefully. Um, I'm going to come back and use Travana and you know, find those sort of experiences.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 22:28

Definitely. So because we are on that topic, Travana is not just AI. reason I don't have Travana. ai in my domain is very intentional because Travana is a travel planning application. It's not in travel AI application. We don't, I don't market that. I say it's an AI powered, but it's not AI only. Travana, we want to. facilitate a platform that will enable users to post their Like in whatever city that you are in right now, there might be someone who have watched Cherry

Track 1: 23:02

Got it.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 23:04

Had they posted that itinerary or had they posted their day day breakdown of what they did when they went to Cherry It would have been so easy for you to just replicate

Track 1: 23:14

it.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 23:15

So what we believe is that when travelers come on, all the travelers come onto one single platform, the network effects that are getting created this platform are unparalleled.

Track 1: 23:27

Got it.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 23:28

Travana wants to address that as well. Travana wants to facilitate that as well.

Track 1: 23:32

Yeah, I think travel is all about that, right? Walking into footsteps that people have traveled and,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 23:39

Yes,

Track 1: 23:40

you know, reliving those experiences. So, it's nice that you did. So, what really sparked this idea? You know, you're not somebody who has been a travel nomad unless you have been. I don't know that. But and what were your challenges in coming up with a company like this? Right? So, of course you're dealing with such big enterprises who've been in this business for so long, right? It feels like they've been in this since the dawn of the Internet. Now you're a new player just out of university and you're trying to build something like this. So, you know, a couple of questions here. What, you know, sparked that idea? What was the immediate challenge that you saw when you thought, okay, I'm going to build something like this. And then how did you find support and you know, what brought it to life?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 24:35

Okay. Okay. I mean, yeah, we can take one by one. So what sparked the idea? It is simple. Yes. I have been, you know, my traveler back in India, when I, right after my graduation, it was cool. It was in COVID. So my third and fourth year of BTech happened mostly in Uttarakhand or Himachal

Track 1: 24:51

Huh.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 24:52

or traveling in Kerala or stuff like that. So I loved my time in India. And I've been a nomad traveler and travel has always been near and dear to me. I've met wonderful people on my journeys and I've had eye opening perspectives when I was traveling. that's definitely there. It's a, it's an integral part of me and who I am. The origin of this idea happened exactly the same time last year, around the same time last year. So, for the last spring break, we went on a trip to

Track 1: 25:22

Okay.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 25:23

and I used to stay with eight of my friends back in my college when I was in college. And we wanted to go to Miami and naturally I took up the travel planning process, being the most experienced traveler in the group. Yeah. And, um, only to realize that the process was not as easy as I imagined it to be. It was horrible. Like I had to spend up to 20 hours watching different YouTube videos, different reading different articles, talking to different people who have already been to Miami, noting all of them in one place manually entering everything into Google Maps, finding an optimized route, figuring out which, what to do in day one, what to do in day two, what to do in day three, Making all of these bookings, making activity bookings, finding the best flight, finding the best Airbnb, best hotel, best car and everything. The whole process was painful. if you ask my friends, none of them would remember anything because I was the one who took the pain. I was the one who did everything. It was havoc. It was really unorganized. And that's when I had this thought. Why is it so unoptimized? And actually, we actually hit my hit the road on Miami. Everything was great. We went to our Airbnb, we checked in and the next morning, our itinerary breaks. The next morning we were going to Key West and it was downpouring rain. Key West is arguably one of the best road trips in America and we enjoyed it in absolute rain. That evening we came back, and there was a concert, we couldn't get parking, and our tickets got wasted just because we couldn't park. Right, so there were instances where a decently planned itinerary failed. And I was very mad on myself that, I'm a decently intelligent person, why is it so hard for me, even after spending so much time, to plan a perfect trip. So this frustration was the origin of the idea Travana. So I sat down in IHOP. There's this beautiful photo where all of my friends are chilling and I'm writing things on iPad. That's when I first wrote about, about Travana or about a platform that could solve this very problem. And that's how Travana started. And from that idea, I came back to college. I started speaking to people in UI UX design. We did a lot of user interviews, market analysis, industry analysis, and everything. And that, that gave me a confidence that. This is a legit problem. People have attempted to solve it in the past. they failed, but now we have AI. Now we have a very powerful technology to support us. So, it would be a decent attempt at this, at solving it, solving this problem and since then till today, I've been passionate about Travana and every conversation that I had was about, had Travana in it.

Track 1: 28:28

That is wonderful. So, um, and what does Travana mean? Does it have a meaning?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 28:35

Oh yeah, it does. So, um, it it's again a little bit personal. So when I wanted to name it something I jumped back to what is the most important and personal thing to me. And there was this college fest that I was a part of when I was in college. It's called Nirvana and Nirvana, as you know, means liberation in

Track 1: 28:55

Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 28:56

and being a yogic being a yogic heritage that I do and being a yoga teacher, I have always admired the concept of Nirvana. In different method and different and customs, right? So the word Nirvana was close to me and I wanted to join travel and Nirvana because what we're essentially doing is liberating a traveler from the pain of travel planning

Track 1: 29:18

Got it.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 29:19

Hence, we joined both the words travel and Nirvana and came up with Travana.

Track 1: 29:23

That is cool. So was it easy? Was it like, yeah, I got my great idea. I'm going to go and build this. And, you know, there you are. Now you have a beautiful website. Was it all hunky dory and easy? Or did you have any challenges? Yes.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 29:39

No, it was not rosy at all. If you cut here and open at my, um, website, then it would seem simple, but it's not. So, um, the last summer, most of the last summer I spent on idea validation. When everyone was taking up internships, I rejected the internship that I had to work on this idea.

Track 1: 30:00

Right.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 30:01

So, I had an internship. I mean, it wasn't anything great, but it was an internship at a decent company, which is run by one of my family friends, a far family friend, and I didn't pursue it because I wanted to pursue Travana, and I sat down to research for this, so it was not simple because I did not have any background on how to start a startup. There was no book. There's no YouTube videos. There's no series that can tell you now you have this brilliant idea. How do you make it a

Track 1: 30:34

Yeah. While there are books, there are YouTube videos, there are,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 30:38

I was not exposed to them. Yeah. Yeah.

Track 1: 30:40

no, even if they are in, even if you watch it that's not, Enough. Trust me. The only way you can start a startup is by starting it, right? And the way you learn about how to start a startup is by starting it. There is no other way to do it. You should watch these videos. You should read those books, but nothing beats practical experience, right? So. Okay. Correct. Correct. Correct. Yeah. It

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 31:07

and I got the idea and I had no clue on how do I build a startup because deep inside I always wanted to have a startup or start a startup. And now I have this idea. Now, the next steps were really, I mean, building an MVP or the most minimal, most viable product or building the first thing that you can show your idea was hard. So, but one thing that really helped, thankfully, I had friends around who were amazing. Great shout out to all my roommates, all my friends from Human Computer Interaction, which helped me in early days put things together. And the first thing that we had was a concept video on, okay, this is the platform that we want to create. Here you can create an itinerary, here you can make bookings, here you can post it on a social media that we have inside Travana, and this is how it is going to look and everything. Another friend came in and said that, you know, Hey, I'm learning AI. I'm learning this and you have a great idea. We, you want AI and I want to practice my knowledge on something. Why don't we collaborate? And that was wonderful because this guy Krishna is, was one of my travel mate in my Miami journey. So again, we sat down and we built a very small streamlit application that would take user inputs and plan and that worked, that was really exciting to a lot of people. And when we put all of this together, it was giving more and more confidence for me that this path is takeable. This path is like, you know, we can walk on this path. It's not that bad or it's not that throny and hot. If we make and decent steps, then we can keep walking. Right? So, something that really helped me is family. Having such amazing family here in US who are all out to support me was my biggest fuel. To be really honest, I was privileged to be doing this. I am really humble when I say this, but not everyone have good family and not everyone has such good privilege to be doing this. And I do, and I wanted to make the best use of what I got. Right. So, family is not a family of great entrepreneurs or we don't come from a business background, but one thing that we constantly kept doing was taking leap of faiths. Like my grandfather took his leap of faith when he left his job and came to us. My uncles took their leap of faith when left their job to start a small consulting company for for software testing. And I took a leap of faith with Travana. So every generation, the definition and the meaning and the scope of loop, a leap of faith increased, but that's because we had a great support system to be helping us. So that's how I was able to pull this website together a lot of support from my family in terms of time, money and commitment and emotional support. said like, like, my family paid for my masters and they were like, it's okay. You take your time. You figure out this journey because not many do this. totally okay to not worry about all of everything that that is there and just work on this. And that support from my uncles both my uncles my but I'm on my maturity mama, like my elder uncle and my younger uncle, they were the reasons for this to float in the first place. And and that's, it was really hard to challenge hard and challenging to start, but a lot of effort and a lot of people helping me and a lot of. and hands. I shaped it the way I did it, and I'm really proud of it.

Track 1: 35:00

takes a village to raise a child. And

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 35:04

to raise a child. For me, it took a country, but yeah,

Track 1: 35:07

it takes you know, family and friends to build an enterprise, right? Um, no, no matter who you see, there is some way that the family is supporting the individual, um, their friends are supporting the individual. The idea and when you don't have that, um, entrepreneurs also feel lonely, right? So there is this constant pressure of revenue and results and stuff like that. And when you have family and friends who believe in what you're doing and they truly support you, that's when miracles happen, right?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 35:42

Yeah, I mean, that's why they call it friends and family round, right? Like, before pre seed, you raise a friends and

Track 1: 35:48

Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 35:49

And it is that relevant to in the journeys of many entrepreneurs that families play a great role in the inception of the idea.

Track 1: 35:56

Correct. That's nice. So, um, what is You know, coming back to technology and AI just because AI is trending, everybody's talking about AI, everybody wants to start an AI company while you were humble enough to say that I am not completely AI, but there is this AI definitely sitting at the heart of Travana, right? Which is, you know, empowering it. So what does one really need to be able to start a company? An AI startup, right? What are those building blocks that you need? Sort of technology? Is it some sort of, you know, skills in terms of people maybe a mix of both? So can you tell us a little bit so that people who, who are thinking of starting up an AI company, you would What do they really need? And I'm talking about people who may not be from a technology background, but they've got a beautiful idea like yours, right? So they've got a beautiful idea and they know that AI can solve that problem, but how do they really go about, um, starting off on that?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 37:00

Okay. I mean, what I would start with is that is a time in history when starting a company has never been easier.

Track 1: 37:07

okay.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 37:10

have so many tools, much content and so much information available online and such big has support like chat GPT to help you guide with ideas and execution and whatnot to start a company. So, that is, there has to be a very clear distinct distinction between an AI company. And a company that uses AI.

Track 1: 37:31

Mm-Hmm.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 37:31

So AI companies like deep tech AI startups, Like Devins or like, like Mistral or like, Lama or Lama index, or all of these great startups or that came up in the last few years, these are working directly on the AI technology to make it better. Startups that are using AI, like myself, are startups are using AI and building on top of them. So, we have very less control on the foundational models that

Track 1: 38:07

Okay.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 38:09

But the but our control is completely on is the foundational model generating and what are we showing to our customers. This is where our business logic comes in. We are bringing multiple things together into one place, one platform, so that it is creating value to our users. But the foundational models we are using, we have no plans on building them ourselves. Like for me to be, to build a travel chat GPT or a travel GPT, just to give perspective, would take

Track 1: 38:43

Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 38:44

Right. And we are no, we are in no intention to do it. What we're trying to do is everything on top of these models. So building models is different and building applications on top of models is different.

Track 1: 38:56

it. Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 38:57

We're building models. You might need a really strong technical knowledge and technical skill in AI, ML and everything. But for this, you don't, because I did not write a single line of code for Travana. We did we did have a great team that, that wrote the code, but what I'm saying is it is possible to not be a coder, to not be a technical person, to start an AI startup today. All it needs is upskilling. While I don't write any line of code for Travana, I know everything what is happening. And it came with a lot of upskilling.

Track 1: 39:34

Got it.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 39:35

Right. So, I did an electrical

Track 1: 39:37

Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 39:38

I had no software background

Track 1: 39:39

That's right.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 39:40

And in masters, I took information systems, which was completely data and analytics, no software background whatsoever. Again, I had to learn a lot of machine learning. I have to learn a lot of retrieval, augmented generation, deep learning concepts, and a lot of them to understand how can we give the offering better. And even today, I have an hour of a day blocked completely to read new things that are happening in AI.

Track 1: 40:07

Okay.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 40:08

And pace at which AI is changing is alarming.

Track 1: 40:13

It is

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 40:14

It is alarming, but at the same time, that gives you an opportunity to stay on top of what is happening. You need not build them, but you need to know what are the right things that you can

Track 1: 40:24

correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 40:25

and build a beautiful solution. So for all the non tech founders, there can't be a better time in history for AI. Where you can actually start a company and still be on non tech. Still not code. is and Devins are supposed to come, they're covered. I applied for an early access, I hope I get in, but more of Devins are going

Track 1: 40:45

Oh, yes.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 40:46

More of agents that can automate things or that can do your tasks are going to come. You need to understand what can I

Track 1: 40:55

Get it.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 40:57

And what is the problem? The the magic here in the entire Travana is not the AI, but the gap, but the figuring out of the gap in the travel industry and the grit and determination to do something about it. Right? So I say to founders is that figure out the problem that you want to solve. You definitely have AI to help you do that. But find out the problem that you have, that you want to solve and have deep empathy towards your problem. Like I am this kind of create a creator or founder where I empathize with my problem a lot. If I'm not able to do this, then I'm not able to solve it in the way I should. I'm not a completely capitalistic or a corporate founder who's creating products just to create revenue. But I'm a very passionate creator like Steve Jobs, where he says, you What founders do or what quality designers and quality builders do to humanity is unparalleled. They build tools for the benefit of entire humanity with so much care, love, passion, and blood and sweat, and they're often not seen. So I'm that kind of a founder where am my first user. I want to solve this problem for myself. I face it. I felt it and I want to solve it. So you have to have this deep level of empathy for you to wake up every goddamn day and say, today, I'm going to do it today. I'm going to do something about it.

Track 1: 42:28

Oh, yeah,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 42:29

Every waking and sleeping hour, you should have that energy, that grit and determination to think about it and believe in your ideas so much. I mean, I could be trying for a I could be trying for a full time job, get it. And my family would be really happy or like I would have a solid career. And everything in stability, I am risking everything that the normal norms of stability or a stable life says by doing this. And you should have the determination, that grit and that just bar to do this. And that's when. And once you have it, then everything will come in place. You can be an artist and become an AI founder. That is absolutely

Track 1: 43:08

it. No, I completely agree with you personally. Um, and, you know, a small segue into my own pursuit for building this whole Indian community is just that right? Because, um, I left India nine years ago, right? And, um, I've been living outside of the country. And what I realized is there are Indian communities, You know, around you wherever you live, there's Indian groceries, there are restaurants and you'll see a WhatsApp group for your neighborhood. You'll see a Facebook group for your neighborhood. But somehow we're not united, um, you know, at a global level where we are able to come together. Um, and talk about, you know, ideas, opportunities, you know, connections and we have slightly fragmented you know, in our own ways and there's also this whole disparity because some people have reached a different status, whereas, you know, some people are just starting off on their journey. So not everybody is. is united. And I fear that, that division is going to break us once again, like it did, you know, many years ago. Right. So for me the passion is, you know, sometimes I wake up at like four o'clock in the morning and I'm on a call and, you know, doing this sort of a podcast. And sometimes my family's like, are you crazy?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 44:39

Yeah. I mean, as a starter as an entrepreneur, if you don't get, are you crazy, then you're not doing it

Track 1: 44:45

That's right. So they're like, are you crazy? What are you doing? And, um, I'm like, I don't know. I mean, that's what keeps me up. I think I'm going to hopefully one day be able to say that. Yes, you know, I've been able to bring people together, bring ideas together connect people. And even if I'm able to touch a few lives. In this whole episode, I may not achieve my goal. That's, you know, there's one is a goal that you say, but then there's, there are goals or milestones that you achieve towards that goal, which may sometimes be larger than that goal. Right?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 45:22

Very true. Very true. And

Track 1: 45:24

that's where I'm kind of headed. And I don't know where I I'll end up, but, um, I do have that passion to kind of bring this community together. Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 45:35

when when you said we don't know where we end up, I mean, I resonate with that, that, you know, we can fail tomorrow, but still be great success in that time that we did. amount of learning that we have, the journey that we took, the fact that we believed in ourself for so long on an idea itself is success. I mean, it might not have tangible numbers associated to it, but for us as an individual, nothing can be better than that. I mean, I don't see entrepreneurship as a success or failure, I see it as a journey. The more you

Track 1: 46:13

Yeah. You travel guys will make everything a journey

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 46:18

Yeah, I mean,

Track 1: 46:19

So what has been the feedback for Travana? What was your early feedback? Of course when you did the whole ux UI research that's all separate, but now when people actually used it I'll reserve my feedback for now, but what are the feedback that you've you've been getting from users?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 46:37

it's been great. So the problem with most of the AI companies that is right now is that people are in excitement to check out what is this new tool. The first few hundred or first, the first few thousand users are in this mode where they want to check out what a sit and not quite use it. But as the tool matured, as we spent like four or five months in the market now, we had, we had early users who planned, who used Travana to plan a trip and they had wonderful experience. Like one of my friend who worked at NASA for internship, Kruti, she used it on her Varanasi trip and she loved it and. A lot of such users as Hemant, who kind of used it for somewhere in the mid in mid America. And he was able to get amazing restaurant recommendations apparently. And he loved it. And a lot of people use it for Washington DC, New York and everything. And it did a great job. It did a decent job. And as I say, we are starting out. This is a very nascent product of Travana. What we want to build is far ahead. And we're on a, we're on this again, journey to better ourself, to build it so that it helps more and more users, but the initial feedback has been wonderful. People have used it. They loved it. There are definitely challenges. There are definitely problems with it. There are definitely logical issues, but are something that we are aware of. We acknowledge and we are fixing it as we speak.

Track 1: 48:04

Absolutely. I think, um, you know, nothing's gonna be perfect. We are always going to refine and irate, and that's what being Agile is all about.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 48:14

Yeah. Being lean is all about

Track 1: 48:16

So, yeah, I wish you good luck with that. And in fact, I also wanted to congratulate you. I noticed you, you recently announced that you'll also be participating in the Antler antler Founder in residency program. Um, can you tell us a little bit more about what this program is and what do you plan to do with it?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 48:36

Oh yeah, definitely. So Antler founder and residency program as a residency program, as it says, as a residency program for founders who wants to start startups, who wants to find co founders, who wants to validate their ideas, and also who want to work towards product market fit and raise money. So Antler is this beautifully structured program for eight weeks, where you have to be there in present. It's a cohort of around 80 people, passionate 80 people, hungry founders. Being, being there to validate ideas, to create MVPs, to create, to validate PMFs and everything. And at the end of cohort, you get a chance to pitch to the investment committee and you get a chance to raise 250k for it, a 9 percent safe note. it's a great opportunity and I'm really excited to start it. We are, I'm moving to Austin, um, on Monday and Tuesdays when Antler is starting.

Track 1: 49:28

Nice, I wish you good luck with that. This is so exciting and i'm sure you'll meet a lot of friends And i'm confident all those 80 people in that Program are eventually going to get hooked on to Travena and use that. So when you're around Austin, everybody's going to be using Travana to make that make those travel bookings. In fact I'll give you an idea of what you should do is ask them to report your bug. Right. And or an improvement and buy them coffee or a bagel or whatever. Right.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 49:59

Yeah, that's interesting. I should definitely do that. like, so, um, what I would advise a lot of founders who want to be founders or who don't have an idea but have this entrepreneurial spirit is to look for things like Antler and join them. because you don't necessarily need to have a startup to

Track 1: 50:20

Okay.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 50:21

You can just be a on committed person with entrepreneurial spirit. And a lot of people coming to Ansular maybe 20 to 30% of the class don't have

Track 1: 50:30

Oh, okay.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 50:32

They, there are people who have left their jobs, left being or exited from other startups and looking to join another startup or stuff like that. So all you need is a drive. you can definitely apply for these

Track 1: 50:45

That's a very good myth buster there. So I was under the impression that, um, to qualify for an antler residency, you have to have a startup and

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 50:55

You

Track 1: 50:55

do not. So that's good to know. I did not know that. And I'm sure a lot of people are under the impression that you've got to have a startup and then only you get into. Program like that. So that's good to know.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 51:06

I'll just tell this one more thing. A lot of farmland residency programs don't need you to do it. But they would need you to show a substantial amount of commitment towards Like, you can't say that you are working on Google full time and you'll do this on the side. You have to quit your job completely and come here day in, day out. You have to work and show commitment in order to become a co founder in order to become, in order to raise or find an idea and

Track 1: 51:31

get it.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 51:32

So it's for those people who want to be startup

Track 1: 51:35

Nice. Nice. That is I wish you good luck again, and not just to you for everybody else who's going to be in that program. I wish you all really good memories and opportunities. That is wonderful. Um, we did a bust here and that takes me to, um, and, you know, a segue to my. question around Indian mythology, right? So you said you're interested in Indian mythology. My first question is, why is it called mythology, right? Is it really a myth? All those stories that we've been hearing, what is your opinion about it?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 52:10

No, I am also, I'm also a culprit in this thing and I shouldn't be doing it, but it's not mythology. It's it has, something that has happened and something that has written when it

Track 1: 52:21

Correct.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 52:23

Something that was witnessed by people who wrote it. Yeah. So it is an itihasa. It is a real thing that happened in India, in ancient India. And these are real stories. They're

Track 1: 52:32

They're not made up, right? And I love the way that you use the word itihasa. And I think. Some of us struggle to interpret these stories, right? And then, of course, um, some of them may be interpretations or variations or different versions based on what people hear or experience or interpret, right? So they may end up going towards, you know, there's always a fine line between fact and fiction. And we live in the world of fake news. So I'm sure there was, um, there was a time when people interpreted things very differently and thought, okay, this is, oh, they did not understand the science. They thought there's magic. And sometimes there was deep science involved, right? In fact, we lost a lot of, Scientific knowledge. Um, you know, in the last few hundreds and thousands of years due to various reasons, but I think I love the way that you are interpreting this as a Itihaasa. And it's not mythology. So that's good to know. Is there a story that you love and has influenced you in becoming who you are?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 53:41

Oh, there are a lot of stories. so I am a very big fan of Bhagavad Gita. And in fact, before even entering into the story, I want to say this, that The first thousand dollars I made, they were out of teaching Ramayana and Mahabharata to kids.

Track 1: 54:02

Really?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 54:05

Yeah, when I was 20, I think, I was 20, and I used to teach kids in America the stories of Ramayana and Mahabharata. I am deeply connected to these epics, these itihasas, and I love telling them, and that's how I became a storyteller. So, all the skills I learned in storytelling, I practiced it in While teaching Raman and Mahata, so I love them. one story, oh my God. It is really hard to pick. I think it has to be Gita and how Arjuna loses his Canva now. I mean, like Arjuna and Kva are Unseparable and Viaa says Arjuna dropped his Canva, which never happened in the story and lost his confidence because he was not able to fight. His own family, his own brothers, his own grandfathers, his own teachers. And that's when Krishna says, you are not what you, what do you think you are? Is not what the reality is. Everything is my writing. Everything, you are just playing your part. So just get up and play your part. You're not doing any crime. And the whole explanation on how is it not a crime, how is it not adharma, how is it not a lot of things, is my favorite part of Mahabharata or Bhagavad Gita.

Track 1: 55:29

That is really interesting. So what is your Gandiva then?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 55:33

Oh there is no one gandiva like in a one thing that I can call my gandiva, but I can say what my Krishna is,

Track 1: 55:43

Okay,

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 55:44

it is Gita, like God is present in the form of Gita around us, who is like, who can navigate us to what we want. And even today, that's how I get my peace. That's how I get my solace. That's how I get my answers.

Track 1: 56:02

that is beautiful. On that peaceful note, Rohan I'm, um, I think we're at time and we, um, we had a wonderful conversation. I feel I feel very excited with what you're doing at Travana. I feel very excited with the potential that you have as a young entrepreneur and I feel privileged. To know you know your story and be connected to you. And I'm sure a lot of people who will listen to this will also find a little bit of Rohan in themselves, right? A little bit of Arjuna in themselves, and then there's going to be Krishna's around them, right? So, this is this is a beautiful episode. One of the best that I would say that I've had, um, conversations with, and, um, I wish you good luck once again for what you're doing. So thank you so much on behalf of the entire Indian community with what you're doing at Travana, solving or taking, making travel, you know, liberating the pains of travel. That's wonderful. Any last message for us at the Indian community?

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 57:12

Thank you so much, Amit. It was my pleasure to be here and I don't think I have achieved enough to be doing this or to be interviewed as of, as such, but any, anything from my story, if it's a learning for someone else, then I would be glad and to the Indian community it's hard out here. It's a struggle. It has always been a struggle. It has been glorified that way that it's all rosy, but it's not leaving homeland, leaving in a foreign country where there are so many things that gains does stacked against us and still striving day in day out to do well to provide for family, to build a legacy, keep at it. You are the real strength. We build America to a great part of America. And we will keep doing that. And we'll doing, we'll keep building India as well. And hard time will pass as we said that there's a seismic shift that is happening. It will settle. Good days will come again and people will be happy again.

Track 1: 58:12

That is great. Thank you so much, Ron.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 58:16

Thank you so much, Amit. I

Track 1: 58:18

Thank you.

rohan-pradyumna--he-him-_1_03-28-2024_122049: 58:18

you.